Jordans topic:
Matthew 5:17-19 KJV
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Did Jesus Christ fulfill EVERY requirement of the law?
If so..... what are we supposed to fulfill?
If not ...... Then we express through our outward actions (of trying to fulfill what we can of the law) that we believe what Jesus said in verse 17 was a lie.
That would be a dangerous thing to believe.
I like verse 19 talking about "...one of THESE least commandments.. " referring to what he was about to say not " one of those formerly written commandments. "
Jordan.
Hey Jordan, Beings as I was first to see this question, I guess that gives me first dibs on responding to it right? :)~
ReplyDelete1Peter 1:19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
What standard was Jesus' life being judged against that Peter could say that he was without blemish or spot? The Torah, right? Okay so now we have to look at the meaning of the word fulfill. When you see the word "fulfill", You think "complete and do away with" right? When I see the word "fulfill", however, I see "live/ed out". we are actually both right. My version of the word (strongs G4137) is used in verse 17. Your version of the word ( strongs G1096) is used in verse 18. That changes the meaning a little I believe.
We've all heard ministers say that GOD doesn't see time like we do. HE sees the full panoramic view of history layed out before him from beginning to end. If that is the case, and if GOD said something as a general rule to be followed at some point in the spectrum. Would it not hold just as much validity now as it did then? Do you think that all of the Tanakh (Old Testament)prophesies have been fulfilled? I don't think so. Just in Daniel alone are a number of prophesies that are yet to come to pass.
One other quick :)~ comment. When Jesus says " One of these least commandments". What is HE refering to, in context? "Therefore" would assume that he was drawing from his topic that he had just talked about,right? If so, then, he was still refering to the law.
Thats my reading on it. Let me know what you think.
Your friend, Orrin
Hey Orrin,
DeleteFirst off, thank you for posting this question.
Your first question, (Twofold)
"What standard was Jesus' life being judged against that Peter could say that he was without blemish or spot? The Torah, right? "
It is my understanding that Jesus' life was being judged against something bigger than the Torah.
Ex. 1. Jesus did not hate anyone. This is not in the Torah.
Ex. 2 Jesus did not lust. This is not in the Torah.
Should I go on?
The Torah did not deal with "Heart Issues".
Christ addressed them when He came.
Question 2. When I see the word "Fulfill" I do NOT think "complete and do away with".
I think Meeting Requirements.
G4137- "To fully satisfy". Christ performed perfect obedience to the law. Fully satisfying the Requirements of it. Vs 17.
G1096 -"To Be Accomplished. Fulfilled."
Vs. 18
Quoting you quick " ..and if GOD said something as a general rule.. "
Is the OT Law a general rule? or specific instructions given for specific events?
Correct me if I'm wrong but things like "Hate, Lust, or Envy" are more general rules then "Murder, Adultery, or Stealing".
Wouldn't the more "general things" be those things that Jesus pointed out in Matt 5? Things that we all experience more?
Reading on in this chapter it is clear to me that Christ set a higher standard of conduct then the Torah did.
We can choose to live under the Torah. Or we can choose to live by 2 simple commands that sum up every law contained in scripture.
Luke 10:27
About "therefore" in context in vs 19. I apologize but I need to do more studying on it.
Here's a thought for food. ;)
Matt 5:27-30. Jesus points out that sin begins in the heart.
If we deal with the "heart issue" ( hate, lust, envy) and overcome it , will the outward action ( murder, adultery, stealing) ever come to pass? My understanding is No.
I like Gal 5:25 "If we live by the spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit."
Does all sin begin in the heart?
Your Friend,
Jordan
Jordan wrote:
ReplyDelete"So I ask... Sid, Shannon, Mike, Tyler, Bo...
Why the veil?
In 2 Corinthians 3:14-17 we read that a veil blinds our eyes when we read Moses, and try to live under the Old Testament. When we accept the New Covenant the veil is taken away and we find liberty in Christ.
When you guys quote Matt 5:18 please note that you are taking it out of context.
Vs 17 Christ states that "He is not come to destroy the Law or the prophets, but to FULFILL.
Notice how He uses the same word in verse 18. "..till all be FULFILLED.
My question is this , and I believe that this is the root of the whole discussion now.
When Christ said that He was come to fulfill the law, did He? The whole thing? Guess not according to you.
What part of the law did Jesus Christ not fulfill?
What requirements are we still obligated to?
Reading on a little in Matt, when he says "Who soever shall break one of THESE least commandments,....." or "..whosever shall keep one of THESE.....
Talking about OT law? or what He was about to say?
Why does Jesus contrast things like "said by them of old time.." with this phrase".. BUT I say unto you...."
Correct me if I'm wrong here but it seems like He is placing a WHOLE lot more emphasis on what He was saying unto them right there, then on what was said before.
Also, Read this...
http://loudcry.org/christ-fulfilled-the-law/
Thanks,
With Prayer that Christ would again rent the veil,
Jordan"
Jordan,
ReplyDeleteFulfill means fulfill. How much was fulfilled? Was all fulfilled if there is a second coming still ahead? The prophets are reliant on the law. No aspect of the law will be slackened until all scripture is fulfilled. That will not happen until heaven and earth pass away. The new heavens and new earth wherein dwelleth righteousness will not need the law of righteousness...it will be automatic. The world we have now needs the law. By the law is the knowledge of sin.
Romans 3
19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
So we are guilty of breaking the law and need a savior. We can never be justified by keeping the law, because we have already broken it. We cannot make up for our sins. That is what breaking the law is...sin. Always was, always will be.
So Messiah fulfilled the law for us. Are we now allowed to sin at will? Is it now not sin to adulterate and to murder, to covet and to steal, to dishonor our parents and to break Sabbath?
It is still sin, because the law still tells us what sin is. It was never given to save us. It was given so that we would know what is and is not sin. It was given to inform our consciences so that we would not invent our own ideas of right(eousness) and wrong, clean and unclean, holy and profane.
2 Timothy 3
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
If Timothy still needed it to know true doctrine, to be corrected, to be instructed in right(eousness) and wrong, and to know everything he needed to know about good works, why don't we? The law was just as fulfilled in his day as it ours. It was not voided by his faith in Y'shua.
Romans 3
31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Now that we are saved, do we make void the law by faith? May it never be. It is still there to testify to our deceitful hearts...our consciences. When we disagree with the law on what is and is not sin, we disagree with YHWH.
Romans 8
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
We fight Him with our fleshly minds. We say that it is alright to break His law. We do not want to be subject to it. We are supposed to renew our minds in His word that tells us what things He likes and what things He doesn't like, what things He wants us to eat and what things He doesn't want us to eat, and what things He calls holy and what things that he calls profane. We need to know these things or we will be rejected from being His priests.
To be continued below.
Continued from above.
ReplyDeleteHosea 4
6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.
Ezekiel 44
23 And they shall teach my people the difference between the holy and profane, and cause them to discern between the unclean and the clean.
24 And in controversy they shall stand in judgment; and they shall judge it according to my judgments: and they shall keep my laws and my statutes in all mine assemblies; and they shall hallow my sabbaths.
So we can either agree with YHWW's law and keep it by walking in the Spirit, or we can let our deceitful hearts trick us out of our reward. What does a new heart look like?
Ezekiel 36
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
Romans 8
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
James 1
22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
Psalm 9
7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.
8 The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.
9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.
10 More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
11 Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward.
You and I have been warned. Our consciences have been informed. Will we allow our deceitful hearts to continue to fight YHWH and refuse to be subject to His law? Will we continue to sin/transgress the law?
Jeremiah 17
9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
We can let the law of YHWH convert our wicked hearts. We can be transformed by the renewing of our minds in His law. We can be greatly rewarded. Or we can deceive ourselves by not putting YHWH's perfect law of liberty into practice and continue to believe that we are righteous when we are living at odds with what YHWH's law calls righteousness.
1 John 3
4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
Shalom
Jordan,
ReplyDeleteYou wrote:
"In 2 Corinthians 3:14-17 we read that a veil blinds our eyes when we read Moses, and try to live under the Old Testament. When we accept the New Covenant the veil is taken away and we find liberty in Christ."
To you, living by the instructions of YHWH is walking in blindness. To you, liberty is getting to break the law. Is that really what Paul is saying? If we read the context carefully we just might get a different idea.
2 Corinthians 3
7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
The law written on stone is the ministration of death. The law written on our hearts is the ministration of life. The law does not change. It is either something we love or something that places restrictions upon our behavior from the outside. We either say, "O how I love thy law!" or, "I wish that I didn't have to keep YHWH's Sabbath." etc.
If the law is still written on stone to you, I see why you do not want to keep it. It looks like bondage...just like it did to those that saw Moses's veiled face. They couldn't see that YHWH's rules of conduct were for their good and for being holy/set apart to Him. They couldn't see to the end of it. They didn't want to regulate their lives by YHWH's definition of love. They didn't love YHWH's law and were doomed to break it.
Jeremiah 31
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
The New Covenant is supposed to write YHWH's commandments on our hearts. That is idiomatic for, "cause us to love it." If it is on our hearts, we want to do it. YHWH's law is YHWH's law. It is either written on stone to us or on our hearts. If it is still on stone to us, the veil has not been removed.
To be continued.
Continued from above.
ReplyDeleteThat is how the Jews of Paul's day read the law. That is why they added multitudes of intricacies to it in their attempt to not break it. They thought that if they stayed way back from breaking it by putting up fence after fence, that they would surely not get close to breaking the actual commandment. The other thing that they did is to pit one law against the other so as to have an excuse for breaking it. Messiah did the opposite. He applied one to the other.
The "You have heard it said by them of old time...but I say unto you." statements are in reference to Jewish rulings/teachings on the commandments of YHWH. Messiah did not say, in Matthew 5, "you have read in the torah." He starts these sets of contrasts with, " For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."
The righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees is by outwardly imposed rulings concerning the torah. Messiah's righteousness comes from inside. We are supposed to want to obey. Does Messiah invent His own laws in Matthew 5? No! He applies the torah in fulness. He fulfills it. He fills it full of the meaning that was always intended.
It is not a new law that one who lusts after another man's wife is committing adultery in his heart. Messiah is simply stating that when you look at commandment 7 and 10 together there is an obvious conclusion. If our hearts are right we will not even covet his wife, let alone go to bed with her. The law must be written on our hearts, if we expect to enter the kingdom of heaven. We must have YHWH's law written on our hearts. The law written on stone will not produce the kind of righteousness that it takes to join Y'shua's government. We will never keep all of YHWH's commandments and teach men to do so if we do not have it written on our hearts. If we do not love His law we will at least break the smallest commandments and teach others to do the same, if only by our actions.
The veil has been removed when we love YHWH's law...when we want to keep it. Then it is no longer a bunch of rules on stone administering death. When we have truly been set free from sin, we stop sinning. The scripture makes it clear that breaking the law is sin.
John 8
34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
Romans 6
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
I highly recommend obedience over sin/transgression of YHWH's law. May it never be that we use grace as an excuse to disobey YHWH's law. That would be sinning. That would be slavery, not liberty.
Shalom
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteJordan,
DeleteYou wrote;
"It is truth that if we love the Lord our God with all our heart, soul, mind and strength and love our neighbor as ourself, that we will never break the OT law. "
So you are saying that when we do not keep the Sabbath we are sinning, that we are failing to love YHWH and our neighbor appropriately, and that we need to repent?
Shalom
Jordan,
DeleteYou wrote:
"It seems to me that a lot of you are insinuating that I am trying to find a way to justify sin."
Not necessarily, but you may be being a hearer of the word and not a doer of it when it comes to the perfect law that James says that we should put into practice. In this regard, you may be deceiving yourself, as James says.
Our hearts can deceive us. That is one reason that we need to look into the mirror of YHWH's torah to see if we are living by every word that proceeds from His mouth. If we find something in our lives that does not match up with the good works, righteousness, and holiness that are described therein, and we walk away without repenting, we have fooled ourselves into thinking that we are being obedient. We have tricked ourselves into thinking that we are walking in true Biblical love, which is demonstrated by our commandment keeping lifestyle.
Shalom
Jordan,
DeleteYou wrote:
"Obviously we can hate someone without killing them. We have kept the OT law and followed the Torah in this situation. Is that good enough?
I hope not."
Leviticus 19
18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.
In actuality we have kept the law to not murder, but Torah is where Messiah got the second greatest commandment to love our neighbors as ourselves. So, though we have not murdered, we have still broken Torah when we hate someone. And when we break torah, we sin. Torah is the details of love for YHWH and love for our neighbors. If we say we love YHWH and purposely do not keep His commandments, we are deceived.
1 John 5
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
You see, the two greatest commandments are found in Torah. All the others hang on these two. They are not separate from these two. They are the definitions/details of these two.
You also wrote:
"It is my understanding that Jesus' life was being judged against something bigger than the Torah.
Ex. 1. Jesus did not hate anyone. This is not in the Torah.
Ex. 2 Jesus did not lust. This is not in the Torah.
Should I go on?"
Did you know that thou shalt not covet means thou shalt not lust?
Exodus 20
17 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour’s.
Deuteronomy 5
21 Neither shalt thou desire thy neighbour’s wife, neither shalt thou covet thy neighbour’s house, his field, or his manservant, or his maidservant, his ox, or his ass, or any thing that is thy neighbour’s.
I am beginning to wonder if you know what torah says. Are you arguing against something that you are ignorant of? I am not slamming you. I am truly concerned that you have listened to men instead of reading the scripture for yourself. You might find. like I did, that the whole scripture fits together and says the same thing, if you can read it through unpredjudiced eyes. The torah is not bad. Listen to Paul.
Romans 7
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet (lust).
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid....
14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
The torah cannot save us. Doing the torah cannot save us. Torah is simply the revelation of what YHWH considers righteous and holy behavior. Why would we not want to act in righteousness and holiness?
Shalom
Jordan,
DeleteYou wrote:
"The Torah did not deal with "Heart Issues".
Christ addressed them when He came."
I have not found this to be the case. The examples that I have posted above are indicative of my stance. You will find that the law and the prophets continually deals with heart issues. There are constant and repetitive calls to love YHWH and our neighbors.
You will find that even the Sabbath and feasts of YHWH, when you set out to keep them as YHWH commands, get directly at deep heart issues.
Psalm 19
7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.
8 The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.
9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.
10 More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
11 Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward.
12 Who can understand his errors? cleanse thou me from secret faults.
13 Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression.
14 Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.
I do not understand how a converted/transformed soul/mind, wisdom, a joyful heart, enlightened eyes, understanding our secret faults, and being spared from presumptuous sins and the great transgression are not heart issues. I know that verse 14 is your heart. I know that you want to obey YHWH and be pure in spirit and body. I also know that without YHWH's law we will stumble on the path of righteousness unnecessarily.
Psalm 119
97 O how love I thy law! it is my meditation all the day.
98 Thou through thy commandments hast made me wiser than mine enemies: for they are ever with me.
99 I have more understanding than all my teachers: for thy testimonies are my meditation.
100 I understand more than the ancients, because I keep thy precepts.
101 I have refrained my feet from every evil way, that I might keep thy word.
102 I have not departed from thy judgments: for thou hast taught me.
103 How sweet are thy words unto my taste! yea, sweeter than honey to my mouth!
104 Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way.
105 Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
Shalom
Jordan,
DeleteIt grieves me that you removed your comment above. Now there is no record of some of the things that I was responding to. I think that it was inconsiderate.
You were probably embarrassed. If I convinced you of an error, it would have been good for you to express that. It looks like you are covering your errors instead of confessing them. A subsequent post with an explanation of what you do not agree with any longer would have been good.
Do we need to start copying and pasting everything you post, so as to be sure that the blog makes sense for those that read it later?
Shalom
Orrin,
ReplyDeleteThe Sunday September 11 blog does not seem to be posting.
Orrin,
ReplyDeleteI figured it out. I was mistaken. Everything is fine.
Shalom
Wow, Bo! You've been busy today speaking the truth in love. There is a lot good stuff here. Every body should slow down and really read it. Respond like you are quick to hear and slow to speak and slow to become "that other thing"...
DeleteYou are right about some things bo. My father in law corrected me on a few things that I have not studied as much as I should.
ReplyDeleteOne thing that I have not put into practice is that of being quick to hear and slow to speak.
It will be a while before I post again because I know need to study more.
Just remember that the best lies are mostly truth. There is a lot of truth here. We just need to figure out what the lie is.
Jordan
Jordan,
DeleteYou wrote:
"Just remember that the best lies are mostly truth. There is a lot of truth here. We just need to figure out what the lie is."
Please consider that the lie may not be on my side of the argument. I do not think that anyone can be saved by works. I also believe that saved people will desire to obey every word that proceeds from the mouth of YHWH. There are 10 words that we know for sure came from His mouth. You probably keep 9 of those 10 already. You might consider the 4th of those 10 also as a first thing to study.
Matthew 24
12 and because lawlessness (disregard for YHWH's law) shall prevail, the love of the most shall grow cold;
13 but he that has endured to the end, he shall be saved.
Our (hot)love for YHWH is shown by our obedience.
1 John 5
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
If we are enduring until the end instead of letting our love grow cold, what will it look like?
Revelation 14
12 Here is the endurance of the saints, who keep the commandments of God and the faith in Jesus.”
Shalom
Jordan,
ReplyDeleteDo not assume that there is a lie here. The presence of a lot of truth may indeed be the sign of THE TRUTH and not a lie.
Love and respect your father-in-law, but do not settle for man's ideas. I think that I have fairly represented both Paul and Moses. If there is a lie in my presentation, ask your father-in-law to expose it to me so that I can reconsider my stance. That is part of loving our neighbors as ourselves.
Leviticus 19
17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.
18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.
I have exposed my ideas and teachings publicly as an elder man. If I am at fault, I should be rebuked publicly so that others may fear.
I was actually expecting this response from you...and your father-in-law. Weigh your choices carefully. Count the cost. It may be more than you are ready to pay. I spent weeks and months saying to myself and YHWH, "Do you know what this means?" before I made the choice to follow in the way I am following now. My oldest son was about 13 (He is almost 28 now.) at the time and with 7 more after him at the time.
I had a lot to consider...a lot of cost to count. All I can say now is, "It was well worth the cost." Ask those that know me if my family is in order and if they are following YHWH with their whole hearts. We are not perfect, but we press on toward the mark of the high calling (to be great in His kingdom) of Messiah. Whatever you do, do not remove your hand from the plow or look back.
Luke 18
24 And when Jesus saw that he was very sorrowful, he said, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
25 For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle’s eye, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
26 And they that heard it said, Who then can be saved?
27 And he said, The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.
28 Then Peter said, Lo, we have left all, and followed thee.
29 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or parents, or brethren, or wife, or children, for the kingdom of God’s sake,
30 Who shall not receive manifold more in this present time, and in the world to come life everlasting.
We live in a wealthy nation. We are all rich by the apostles' standards. We have a difficult time forsaking people and things. I hope and pray that you will not have to leave any relatives behind for the sake of the kingdom of YHWH.
Shalom
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSorry, I posted the above in the wrong place.
ReplyDeleteJordan, If you think anything I or anyone here has said is a lie, you don't have to believe it. If you got on a sight with a bunch of Mormans or Orthodox Jews, or Jehovah's Witnesses the difference would be clear to you so you could label it as false teaching. Here though, it is different.
ReplyDeleteI guess you can stay a gentile (definition) convert to Christianity and never follow the Torah or the Prophets and believe in the shed blood of the Messiah and you will be saved (definition).
The only thing you will miss is being great in the kingdom of Heaven. The reason I would argue with any one is just that. I want disciples to be great. YHWH deserves us to be great and He has told us how to be so. Matt 5:19.
That is not out of context. You know He was quoting his real commands and instructions and in him is no false thing and He changeth not.
I am praying for you and your young family. Not that you will agree with me, but that you will be all YHWH has created you to be: Great!
When in doubt, Don't. or No Pain, No Gain. Are they just cliche'?
You are showing great wisdom. Your wife must be hugely proud of you. It is good to take advice from your Father-in-law.
Wise men consider a matter before answering. The opposite of Prov 18:13. I am here to be encouraging, not destructive.
Mike,
ReplyDeleteWhen I am passed on from this life to the eternal one, the only thing that I could possibly want is constant presence in the sight of my Father.
He is my GREATEST reward. Nothing else matters to me. I'm not seeking some extra gold star on my crown or a mansion with a better view, I will have Christ, and therefore have EVERYTHING!! It will be great! If they decide to not give me a home when I'm there, I would be ok with that. I will still get to be in the presence of Christ continually.
It is not about “me” getting anything. It is about being great for Him and the benefit of His Kingdom. Yeshua is the one that started this, not me looking for something to “get”.
ReplyDeleteDo we enter the Kingdom upon death or are we in the Kingdom now?
ReplyDeleteIt seems it is at hand, coming, shall be, and now.
I have offered a big reward to my children a few times. $50 to the first one to ride the unicycle and $50 to the first one that could play the Maple Leaf Rag.
ReplyDeleteYes I benefited. I like the Maple Leaf rag. It is fun to see someone ride the unicycle.
Yes the ones that "took the kingdom by force" and were first to accomplish the mission I offered had some spending money.
But the real reward for them was that they made themselves better and they gained confidence that they could do anything that they set their minds to. They got to enter into the joy of their father/lord.
They did it for the money. They did it for their father's joy. They got rewarded. I was rewarded. Do we not want our Father in heaven to be rewarded? Do we want to make Him sad? Do we not want to make Him proud of us/joyful so that we can enter His joy?
Shalom
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